robbreid , 11-06-2008 08:35 AM ATC of Lear XC-VMC and radar map, shows helicopter passing (higher, marked A1507 on radar map) between Mexicana Boeing767 and (several miles behind B767, the) Lear just before lear disappears from screen. https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:l5lTb3Ze-GMJ:https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/corporate/33059-mexico-city-learjet-crash-nov-4-08-a.html+&cd=7&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
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TIME/CNN article states Mexican Police foiled an assassination attempt against one of the passengers earlier this year….
robbreid Seems very odd to me that the Lear would be cruising in at 250 knots, from radar, it was very busy, and the crew were very experienced at this airport.
…robbreid They explain that the flight controller called speed reduction to 180 and the Lear Jet was slow to obey the order. After they see a slowing sharply, going from 260 knots to 180, in a few seconds, and further down to 160, 149 and up to 113 knots.’
By then it was just over a minute behind the B767
Dude- 7000ft 260kts ground speed he was above the 250Kts Va, My guess Wake Turbulence ABOVE Va and the engiene fell off. That plane has more then enough power to get out of trouble, but when you hit some nasty nasty at a fast speed you break the airplane.
robbreid The more I read about this accident, the more it is looking like something to do with the excessive loss of speed. If they deployed their spoilers to reduce speed, what if they failed to retract spoilers and deployed flaps?…
From the radar, it looks like they are within legal limits, and from that distance a a B767 has never knocked another plane out of the sky.
tulip Many people on the ground said they saw a fireball coming down, not only one person. Others said they saw a light at the tail.67 has never knocked another plane out of the sky….Why were 2 helicopters at the same place shortly before the accident. They must have seen something, nobody ever questioned them one was just 600 Meter below the jet. Why was the PFP the police force 5 Minutes later at the scene, and one person heard the officer talk on a radio: The Pichon is not in the air and two is out. Two is the second in charge of the country I guess. How does this sound to you?
They also mentioned that the black box did not record, only the one with the voices in the cabin and the pilots. The other black box was not conected or was not working since 2006? The Jet was in the United States or more than a month why did they not repair it?
tulip In the radar there is a helicopter [marked A1507 on radar map} close to the Lear Jet, with a difference in altitude of 600 Meter, this helicopter had not problem with the turbulence and arrived sound and safe , AFTER IT LEFT AT 18.44.At 18.20 this Helicopter arrived with Alejandro Simon, Son, at a heliport of ICA.At 18.27 left again and returned at 18.39 with father Alejandro Simon, and left at 18.44 this is when he was close to the Laer jet. Nobody knows where this Helicopter went to,they say to Toluca. This si where the company is stationed.
Nobody asked this pilot of the helicopter what did he see that night.
Aerolines ejecutivas at the same place than the company who gives service to the Laer jet, say it was not their helicopter, whos helicopter was it? Who were the pilots, why do they not come forward? After the jet went down, one still can see the helicopter in radar, but not the jet. One pilot who wants to stay in anonimity says this helicopter when he went to Toluca should not have been at the place where he was, he should have taken another route. Could this helicopter have something to do with this “accident”.
azav8r The aircraft was not equipped with a Flight Data Recorder “black box” nor was it required to. It was only equipped with a Cockpit Voice Recorder. Further, to my knowledge, there is no provision for a FDR in the Lear 45.
robbreid From what I read, the Captain is said to have 3,664 hours in aircraft other than the Lear 45, plus 536 hours in the Lear 45….As for the helicopter, I’d read, it was following a regular helicopter track, and in fact was the 139th helicopter to pass that route that day. As for interviewing the pilots of the helicopter, I’ve no idea who investigators have talked to or not?? The Lear traveling faster than the B767, came within 4.15 miles of the B767, and was 1 minute and 12 seconds behind. It remained there for 15 seconds. The Lear was then observed turning on its own axis clockwise, and dropping sharply belly up. It impacted the ground at 42 degrees.
https://discussions.flightaware.com/t/xc-vmc-learjet-45-crashes-in-mexico-city-suburb/6481/7 https://discussions.flightaware.com/t/xc-vmc-learjet-45-crashes-in-mexico-city-suburb/6481/29
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10-3-2012 A high-level attorney for the Beltran Leyva faction of the Sinaloa Cartel has revealed that two of Mexico's busiest international airports, in Cancun and Toluca, are controlled by Mexican drug cartels. https://www.madcowprod.com/2012/10/03/source-drug-cartels-control-mexican-airports/
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Not related specifically to above:
More shocking and more important, the bank was sanctioned for failing to apply the proper anti-laundering strictures to the transfer of $378.4bn – a sum equivalent to one-third of Mexico's gross national product – into dollar accounts from so-called casas de cambio (CDCs) in Mexico, currency exchange houses with which the bank did business. "Wachovia's blatant disregard for our banking laws gave international cocaine cartels a virtual carte blanche to finance their operations," said Jeffrey Sloman, the federal prosecutor. Yet the total fine was less than 2% of the bank's $12.3bn profit for 2009….
Over two days, 10 wire transfers by four individuals "went though Wachovia for deposit into an aircraft broker's account. All of the transfers were in round numbers. None of the individuals of business that wired money had any connection to the aircraft or the entity that allegedly owned the aircraft. The investigation has further revealed that the identities of the individuals who sent the money were false and that the business was a shell entity. That plane was subsequently seized with approximately 2,000kg of cocaine on board." …
The deferred prosecution is part of this "cop-out all round", Woods says. "The regulatory authorities do not have to spend any more time on it, and they don't have to push it as far as a criminal trial. They just issue criminal proceedings, and settle. The law enforcement people do what they are supposed to do, but what's the point? All those people dealing with all that money from drug-trafficking and murder, and no one goes to jail?" https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/apr/03/us-bank-mexico-drug-gangs
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